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Master or master

ana sana s
edited May 2015 in Writing
Help appreciated. I'm checking proofs. I've got a character called Master Jeopardine. I've capitalised Master when used in place of his full name as in 'I know Master's devilish particular,' but what about these:

...billow of the Master's dressing gown.
'We'll let the Master find out for himself.'
...said the Master.

Confusing myself.
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Comments

  • LizLiz
    In each case you are using the title as his name, so it will be a capital.
  • Phots MollPhots Moll

    Confusing myself.
    I know that feeling!

    I'm not sure I entirely agree with Liz. Yes, do use a capital letter if you're using it in place of his name, but I'm not sure that's precisely what you're doing in those examples. Doesn't preceding it with 'the' make it less direct?

    As a different example -
    'Would you like tea, Vicar?" would be correct, but would you write "I wonder if the Vicar would like tea?" I think the capital would be dropped.
  • Baggy BooksBaggy Books
    edited May 2015
    I'd agree with PM. Context is always going to drive the answer.

    Master is always going to be tricky - the employee's subservient position almost demands he is referring to a/the Master, irrespective of rule.

    I don't think anyone would ever write about Dr Who's Master/the Master in lowercase.
  • LizyLizy
    I would use Master in place of 'Jim', but the master in place of 'the boss'.
  • LizLiz
    edited May 2015
    Hmm, that was how I was looking at it, Baggy. As his name, if all he is ever called is Master.
  • Lou TreleavenLou Treleaven
    You could use his name, Jeopardine, in the narrative, rather than the Master. If he was called Lord Salisbury you would probably call him Salisbury rather than the lord. Then in speech he can be Master and that gets rid of your problem!
  • Mrs BearMrs Bear
    'billow of the Master's dressing gown.'
    'We'll let the Master find out for himself.'
    '...said the Master.'

    If 'the master' is a reference, not a title, it doesn't take a capital.
    For example, if Miss Jeopardine was referred to as the mistress, it wouldn't take a capital - it's not her name, but her position in the household. The same applies to Master J: 'the billow of Master J's dressing gown' is not the same as 'the billow of the master's dressing gown.'

    In Baggy's Dr Who example, the Master is always referred to as The Master - therefore he would always take a capital as though he were the Duke.
  • LizLiz
    *suspects she will be here if ever writing a narrative*
  • ana sana s
    Thanks all. So just to be clear, Mrs Bear, all of the examples refer to position and should be lower case.
  • Mrs BearMrs Bear
    Yes, Ana.
    'Who is Master Jeopardine? He's the master of the house.' -If in doubt, try the line with a different name: 'Who is Lord/Edward Jeopardine? He's the master of the house.' The confusion lies in the difference between Master as title, and the master - a position in the household.
  • LizLiz
    So really, if 'the' is in front, it's not a capital?
  • Mrs BearMrs Bear
    It's not that easy, Liz! For example, the Duke of Beaufort is always going to be the Duke, because it's always his title. 'Where is the Duke now?' means, 'Where is the Duke of Beaufort now?' 'She left her shawl in the Duke's bedroom.' It's still his title, so takes a capital.

    In Ana's example, Master is his title (unless he was christened Master, as one would use Edward, in which case a) I'd give his parents a funny look and b) he'd then be referred to as Master Master Jeopardine); the examples refer to 'the master of the house', not 'the Master Jeopardine'.

    Just to add a note: according to the Oxford Style Guide, if you refer to Mr Jones, the head master, there would be a comma but no capitals: that's because you're giving him his position as a form of clarification. If you refer to the Head Master Mr Jones (with no comma) you do use capitals, because it's his title.

  • ana sana s
    Thanks for the clarification, Mrs Bear. The capital feels intuitively right in context because he is so masterfully and overwhelmingly the Master. Lower case seems a bit piddling. Not grammatically logical, just a feeling.
  • LizLiz
    If his importance is such, could they just say 'Master' instead of 'the master'?
  • ana sana s
    The waifs do. Higher status people and the narrator say the M/master.
  • neilneil

    Confusing myself.
    I know that feeling!

    I'm not sure I entirely agree with Liz. Yes, do use a capital letter if you're using it in place of his name, but I'm not sure that's precisely what you're doing in those examples. Doesn't preceding it with 'the' make it less direct?

    As a different example -
    'Would you like tea, Vicar?" would be correct, but would you write "I wonder if the Vicar would like tea?" I think the capital would be dropped.
    Agree entirely. In fact I once had my 'vicar' in a similar context changed by an editor to 'Vicar', whilst all the 'the vicar' references were left as they were.
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