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I don't think Mrs Bear's suggestion is necessarily wrong, but it's not the normal convention as far as I'm aware.
Without seeing the whole story it's difficult to know exactly how to advise you, but my temptation would be to drop the ellipses, italics, and/or dashes completely. The extracts you've posted suggest the character is mulling these things over in his mind and the repetition of "so" in the first one and "such" in the second implies a particular emphasis by itself. You run the risk of overloading the text with any more than that.
Obviously, that's just my take on it. I'm a fan of the 'less is more' philosophy - particularly when it comes to flash fiction.
You run the risk of overloading the text with any more than that.
Obviously, that's just my take on it. I'm a fan of the 'less is more' philosophy - particularly when it comes to flash fiction.
Yes, I know what you mean about 'overloading' and I take your point regarding 'less is more' which is why I wanted to show his dilemma with those pauses. I'm trying to achieve subtlety and a degree of elegance. I might have to rethink this after all.
I've seen my suggestion used in fiction, Claudia, often with the word after the dash in italics. If we want to get technical: Ellipsis is used to show that some words have been omitted, or where dialogue trails off, or to show that a sequence continues as begun, so there's no need to go on. The dash you're using isn't an omission or a tailing off as such; it's a gap in thought, a hiatus. You can use the dash!
TN, yes, because you are inserting the name into a sentence that would still make sense without it (though it would hold less information). An alternative would be: 'Martha quite liked Freda, the life-size black and white cow who stood to one side of the playroom.' 'Martha quite liked the life-size black and white cow Freda, who stood to one side of the playroom.' This doesn't work at all. Wouldn't a toy/model cow be a which/that, not a who?
We refer to pets as though they are people, TN, so you could go with 'who' if you're speaking to friends, or 'that' in more general use. 'That' is used for people or things, 'which' just for things. Your cow is a model, not a real animal, but again, 'that' would cover it. And we wonder why foreign people think English is difficult!
Comments
Without seeing the whole story it's difficult to know exactly how to advise you, but my temptation would be to drop the ellipses, italics, and/or dashes completely. The extracts you've posted suggest the character is mulling these things over in his mind and the repetition of "so" in the first one and "such" in the second implies a particular emphasis by itself. You run the risk of overloading the text with any more than that.
Obviously, that's just my take on it. I'm a fan of the 'less is more' philosophy - particularly when it comes to flash fiction.
I might have to rethink this after all.
Thanks for all your help, folks!
If we want to get technical:
Ellipsis is used to show that some words have been omitted, or where dialogue trails off, or to show that a sequence continues as begun, so there's no need to go on.
The dash you're using isn't an omission or a tailing off as such; it's a gap in thought, a hiatus. You can use the dash!
http://www.punctuationmadesimple.com/PMSEmdash.html
And
http://theeditorsblog.net/2010/12/08/punctuation-in-dialogue/
And finally:
http://www.ox.ac.uk/public_affairs/services_and_resources/style_guide/punctuation.html#adashes_and_hyphens_
Am I right to use the comma before 'Freda'?
This has been questioned.
'We should be there-' quick look at his watch-'about ten minutes'
using hyphens because he is interrupting himself to look at watch. [I tend to use dashes to indicate pause or afterthought].
depending on what went before and after, the context, I might avoid this situation and find a different way.
just a thought... :>
He looked look at his watch-'about ten minutes'
presumably the question has been asked. Why repeat it?
'How long before you get here?
I will be there in ten minutes.
'How long before you get here?
'Ten minutes'
You'll see (a few comments back) that I'm now bleating about something else!
An alternative would be:
'Martha quite liked Freda, the life-size black and white cow who stood to one side of the playroom.'
'Martha quite liked the life-size black and white cow Freda, who stood to one side of the playroom.' This doesn't work at all.
Wouldn't a toy/model cow be a which/that, not a who?
I'm trying to think how we might describe a pet cat/dog/ guinea pig as it's the same sort of concept.
E.g.
I have three dogs, Suki, Jed and Bruce. Jed is the one who/which is most intelligent.
I've confused myself. Drawn a blank. I'll come back later and look again with fresh eyes.
And we wonder why foreign people think English is difficult!
*looks at Freda through magnifying glass and ponders*